Damn

I don't know the rest could you explain for reference.????

At least you had the courage to try, and from here it can only get better, right?

Cheers,

How can you get better at it if you don't attempt it?

Exactly. I've played pieces that are really way beyond my level; I just played them so much I could do them on basis of muscle memory.

Ah now I understand so if I don't attempt a piece in a few years time I will be able to play it perfectly, amazing concept, if that was the case the complete population of the world would be able to play everything ever written perfectly, without attempting it at all.

What you probably mean is that you don't want to play it ALL, all the way through, without further study - or perhaps not. Further clarification would be good.

Like, 'then I woke up' ?

Well, music wouldn't be any fun if we played things perfectly right from the outset, would it?? I have to say that part of what I enjoy most about the piano is learning.

Rubberband Girl

Exactly right. Parroting is a good metaphor for the process. I might just add one thing. For an elderly person, say 45+, who never developed the playing skills when younger, and is playing mostly for their own enjoyment, and is *not* trying to become a skilled pianist, then 'parroting' might just be what they can handle with limited practise time. Like my case: I am 52. I was mostly self taught till about the age of 40, then I had a master of the concert stage as a teacher for a few of years. He passed away in 1997. So I picked up some great stuff from him, but now I'm lucky if I can get in 45 minute a day and my memory is starting to fail. I am practising Lizst's Sonata in B-, which is somewhat beyond my abilities. I can play some of the Goldberg Variations, Debussy's Premier Arabesque, and such. These I worked on with my teacher, so I know they are about the right level. Point is, I know that it's not proper development for my pianistic skills, but then again, I'm not intending to be a pianist, just a once in a while piano banger who enjoys the music. William Stevens, my one great teacher, put the discussion this way... You need to get as many 'handles' on the piece as possible. Muscle memory, or 'finger memory' is just one handle. If that's all you have, it will fail you if there is the slightest distraction. It *is* important because someday a great pianist will be on the world stage playing a piece he/she knows well and in the middle of it her/his mind will go,...'I wonder where I parked the car.' and then the 'machinery,' the fingers will have to take over for a bar or two. But to trust the whole piece to your fingers, (if you want to be a really good pianist who doesn't make mistakes and have to start over now & then), is inviting disaster. Other handles would include being able to write the piece on music sheet paper. Or what Bill used to do, play it in several keys so the relative intervals and chord positions are as well known as the absolute notes. Bill said once you can play the piece in 4 or 5 keys you have a much better chance of not getting lost. He was continually giving me new fingering for my pieces when I practised them, for the purpose of breaking up my finger memory and preventing me from 'parroting.' It was difficult at my age to have to relearn the piece several times, but I knew it much better afterwards. I could go on, but time is short here.

After you've played Islamey, what is left to learn? Just curious.

Now that's a tough one. I find it very, very difficult to unlearn an effective fingering and replace it with an other effective fingering (it happens with different editions of same piece). On the other hand, practicing a piece is a repetitive process which establishes some 'finger/muscle' memory . Otherwise, knowing to push the 'buttons' of each key what would be the purpose of practicing a piece. And those who need very little practice for a new piece are using bits/patterns of 'finger/muscle memory' they acquired in many other pieces. I think this is what Czerny had in mind when he wrote the 'exercises in passage playing', that is providing the 'aspiring' pianist with well known(practiced) and finger memorized building blocks to be used in other pieces.

I agree with this. Morover I learned easy pieces without paying attention to details and later I found that I was not respecting the rests or the value of some notes - holding them down more than written. It sounded o.k. so it did not bother me. Trying to re-learn the etude , this time 'as written' was very difficult.