Solved the amplification problem on my digital at home....

I'm just posting this bit of info because I KNOW there's has to be someone out there going through the same type of problem.

One year ago I bought a Roland RD-150 for use at home. Heard it in the store. Loved the sound. Of course they had it hooked to a monster system. I realized I wouldn't get the same sound at home but with a pretty good amp I should at least come close. After going through the first 2 amps (they sounded lousey) and were returned to the store, I went for the bucks and bought what I believed to be a great keyboard amp to at least come close to what I heard in the store. At least that's what the salesman(boy) told me. (A Roland KC-300 - a $500.00 buck amp). And no doubt this is a monster keyboard amp. NO DIFFERENCE! Muddy, some notes sounded like feedback etc. I gave up and have just settled for the last 9 months and was truely unhappy. To this day I can't explain why this was happening.

My frustration rolled around again this month and I had to try again. There I go again.... putting rugs under, over, around the amp... laying towels over in front of the amp.... putting it up high, low, in the middle.... facing it against a rugged wall... placing it in ten different locations in the room, etc. etc. etc. Man! I was goin freakin nuts! THEN....(the amplification God above shown down his mercy on this poor, wretched, freakin out soul)

Today I was in Office Depot doing a little shopping for work. Strollin the isles I arrive at the computer speaker systems, stopped, stared and wondered... Hmmmm... No... Impossible... It would never work... It couldn't... Ridiculous!

So as I leave the store with this little box containing $49.00, 40 watt computer speaker system w/sub-woofer under my armpit, I can't help but think what an shmuck I am. And now I'm in Radio Shack buying the adapter for the little jack on this little shit speaker system that I'm already prepared to return tomorrow.

Well, I go home and hook this baby up. With sub-woofer on the floor & the two satilite speakers up on the table, I kick on the juice. I slowly, softly press a couple of keys and them more keys and and then louder and....Hoooollllyyy Crap! It's the clean, clear, crisp piano sound the sound I first heard in the store. (the home version of cousre) I can finally hear the WHOLE chord—no strange accoustical problems. And with good power, and no distortion! These little speakers kick. The problem is gone! I'm healed-praise be! I can now enjoy my fabulous, creative, unbelievable toe-tappin piano playing once again! I know nothing about amplification or accoustics and once again, I can't give any technical explain regarding this problem I was having. Just one guess though.... I thought back to my professional days when I was in the biz and maybe these gig amps are great for what they are... gig amps... maybe they need and open unincumbered space to play out. (that sounded dumb - but I'll leave it in anyway) :

Moral of the story - don't bring home a giggin amp for home use - AND... save yourself a ton of money. As it is now, I own a $500.00 keyboard amp that I'm going to have to try & sell for half the price. Anyone out there in the market? LOL

Well, I really hope that this will help someone else who might be dealing with such a situation.

Cliff

btw - twice I said I can't explain this.... I would really love an explanation from someone with some knowledge of amplification or accoustics or whatever.

Same thing with my digital piano. It's plugged into two wall-wart powered computer speakers (no sub). They sit on the piano and are two feet from my ears and they sound great.

<<some stuff much better than I could>>

I run my P-80 through a couple of 12'/horn cabs, but it gets savagely eq'd on it's way there and runs through a studio quality amp. When running other music sources through I tend to have to boost the deep bass a little, kill much of the mid range and open out the top to get a pleasent tone. The moral of this story is that pretty much anything is a compromise, and those computer speakers are prolly adjusted to make anything sound nice... you have to be a smug idiot like me to try and make gigging gear sound 'nice' in a small environment... and believe me, it takes more money than most people are prepared to shell out... (it would have been easier just to buy some decent cabs... but I enjoy a challenge)

Thanks for the very informative posting, Cliff. I can't explain your problem, but I know that I too have been curious about what really distinguishes a computer sound system costing $99 from a professional PA costing many times more. Especially having seen 'specifications' like '800 Watts' on a cheap computer system.

One thing I had to do once upon a time, with a cheap PWM (pulse width modulated) toy synth, was to prepare a special cable with two resistors soldered in as an attenuator, to make the level compatible with my amp. I am quite sure this was not your problem.

If you ever go back to that music store with your keyboard and amp, and ask the salesman to let you compare directly the sound from your system vs. theirs, I would be interested in hearing the results.

Martin Green http://www.onforeignsoil.com 'On Foreign Soil'...the book that starts in English and turns to Yiddish.

<< I run my P-80 through a couple of 12'/horn cabs, but it gets savagely eq'd on it's way there >>

That helps a lot. Control pattern devices will rip your ears off if you're not careful.

<< The moral of this story is that pretty much anything is a compromise >>

Wide dispersion speakers have a more limited 'throw' and while better in smaller rooms, they have their limitations in larger performance spaces. So in many respects, trying to find a 'one size fits all' solution is nigh unto impossible and yes, everything not specifically engineered for one single environment (or type of environment) is a compromise.

<< try and make gigging gear sound 'nice' in a small environment... and believe me, it takes more money than most people are prepared to shell out... (it would have been easier just to buy some decent cabs... but I enjoy a challenge) >>

And you're killing two birds with one stone, Al. If you can make them work to your satisfaction in the small space and still have the fire power for your band gigs, you have made the most cost effective decision for your needs. This is not lunacy, it's great efficiency.

to be honest I tend to use my rig as my monitor system, I'm damned if I'm going to run it hard to try and match some damn guitarist. I tend to run a line out to the band's PA which I control, by mixing carefully I can balance the power between the two to give me sufficient presence without impacting on my tone...

Al

hifi geek... ironic... given what I listen to music through...

Hi CLiff, I just recently purchased an RD-150 myself. I have been a gigger for years so I have several amps. the best way to amplify these keyboards is to use two amps or a P/A speaker system. But when the keyboard is at home I plug it into a home stereo system and it sounds outstanding. I also have used PC speakers with good results. I believe in the music store they probably also hooked up in stereo. Tonight is my RD-150s first gig. BTW, the KC-300 is an excellent amp. You probably were hearing the keyboard in mono unless you actually rigged up another amp with the KC-300. One thing about the RD-150 is that they have actually incorporated stereo 'panning' which means when you playu the high notes, the sound is more to the right, and the low notes more to the left. You completely lose that effect if you dont use stereo. Anyhow , I am impressed with the RD-150 and I think you have a good inexpensive solution with the PC speakers. Good Luck

I know this is a funny question that no one asked you, but what type of computer speakers did you buy? I'd love to have a light sound system to carry with for smaller locations.

As an aside, I run with an RD-700 and I use a single JBL EON PAK 15 (I think it is 100 watts) and I use it at home, at my synagogue, in big halls, and in tents outside. It kicks.

What may have happened to you (I am not sure) is maybe you bought the wrong KIND of amp when you bought the big ones. This may be pedantic, so please don't be offended. Guitar amps won't handle the bass notes, and bass notes won't handle the high notes. The amp I bought is specifically designed for keyboards (full range), cost more, and is worth it.

Gary

Cliff,,can u tell me what kind of amps that u purchase ,, the name, watts, and do u have it hooked up to your computer or just on top of your piano?? Please email me.

Thanks Bronzee

At home, I use a small 50w stereo power amp, a 15-band stereo EQ, and a pair of Event 20/20 direct-field monitors ($300/pr). They sound excellent, and the price is right, too.

Michael Walthius THE MUSIC OF CYBERSPACE

It's called CyberAcoutics Gary. (Never heard of it before) Remember, I just grabed it off a shelf out of impulse and desparation. It's only 40 watts. But I don't know if you'd want to take it on a job. These things are kinda wireee. I mean it's three pieces with wires from the small satilites to the woofer and to the keyboard etc.... I was all tangled up even in a comfortable enviroment like my house. I don't know if I'd want to deal with it on a gig.... but who knows, maybe I'm wrong.

And btw, thanks for all those great explanations as to my previous problem.