Some Handel, Rameau etc. opera questions

Erato is having some kind of anniversary and they are selling quite a bit of their older catalogue at very reasonable prices. I'd be grateful for comments on the following:

Gluck Iphigenie en Aulide, Gardiner/Dawson/Otter (cast looks very promising, the only Gluck I know so far is Gardiner's recording of the Berlioz version of Orphee)

Handel Alcina, Christie

Handel Amadigi, Minkowski

Handel Teseo, Minkowski

I decided to broaden my knowledge of Handel operas a little before shelling out for another Giulio Cesare. But are these recordings worthwile? I know there is not much competition, but if these older recordings are a long way from Minkowski recent work and/or the singers are not up to their tasks, I'd rather skip them. I was also told that the Christie recording lacks power (The guy who said it doesn't like Christie anyway, but knows a hell of lot about Handel operas)

Haydn Armida, Harnoncourt

received very favorable comments, justified?

Rameau Les Boreades, Gardiner

Rameau, Platee, Minkowski

I know very little Rameau so far (Indes galantes suite, some harpsichord), would any of these be a good introduction to his operas?

there are also recordings of Handel's op.3 by Minkowski and Gardiner, how about these. Op.3 is certainly uneven, but some of the concertos are very good and the set doesn't seem as well served on records as op.6

thanks for any comments

Worth getting.

Quite good, though I don't think Fleming sounds right in this context - her style doesn't go well with HIP and her slightly swoopy, careless singing doesn't work in Handel.

I can't stand Gutmann's voice (I think she's in both) and must confess that the music doesn't interest me terribly, but while Minkowski is a more interesting conductor now than he was then, you needn't have any concerns that these are inferior performances. Try one and see what you think; if you like it, you will probably like the other.

I was also told that the Christie

That's true of Christie in everything I've heard him conduct.

Yes.

[snip]

Actually, I think it's better served than Op. 6, at least inasmuch as there are more recommendable recordings of op. 3. Both Minkowski and Gardiner are good, the latter a bit better played, the former a bit more characterful.

(snip; I agree more or less with Simon - I rather like Natalie Stuzmann, who's only in Amadigi, not in Teseo).

The best introduction is probably Hippolyte et Aracie, his first opera and the one I like most. There are two very good recordings: Minkowksi and Christie. I prefer Minkowski (with a marvellous Bernarda Fink), but not everybody does. Les Boréades was his last opera, written when he was already in his seventies. Highly interesting, because it shows that Rameau's style was still developing at his age. PLatee is a bit different from most iof his opera's, because it contains many comic aspects. Other execllent recording of a beautiful Rameau opera is Minkowski's Dardanus.

Benjo Maso

Simon Roberts schrieb:

the only competition seems to be an older non-HIP recording with IIRC Sutherland, which doesn't really look like a better option, so this one is probably still the best until Minkowski or Gardiner get around to record it. The piece is performed quite frequently in Germany so it's somewhat surprising that there are not more recordings...

Is it such a big difference to the roughly contemporary Rinaldo or to Julius Caesar ten years later? I am aware that Handel's operas are somewhat uneven, probably mostly due to extreme time pressure and/or weak libretti, but he could be quite fabulous when he was still very young (Dixit, some of the Italian cantatas etc.)

benjo maso schrieb:

If you like her, you are diagreeing quite a bit with Simon So would you recommend either of them, or do you also think the pieces are not really worth one's while?

thanks for your comments, I will see how much time and money will be left for Rameau

I like Gardiner's Tauride (on Philips). Don't know his Aulide.

The best intro to Rameau's operas is Hippolyte et Aricie or Castor et Pollux . . . in that order. None of his operas is without interest, but as Rameau himself confessed with chagrin, in some respects he lost it after the earlier operas, even as he became a fussier and more refined composer. (Wish I could quote his remarkable comment, but I can't remember it.) Les indes galantes is delicious.

Try as I might, I can't seem to get into Haydn's two late opera seria, although I love the mixed-genre operas he wrote just before the Op. 33 quartets, including above all the last two, La fedelta premiata and Orlando paladino. (Mozart was impressed by Fedelta and Orlando is cut from similar cloth. Armida and Orfeo are the only operas Haydn wrote after Fedelta and Orlando, but much later in his career.)

I'm sure the last two operas have their fair share of good music in

Decca assembled an extraordinary cast of singers for that Sutherland Alcina, none of them with the possible exception of Sutherland as boring as the average voiceless HIP singer/nonentity. There is no way in hell that Handel made use of self-effacing voiceless bores in his lifetime. He would have made use of larger than life divas and divos for better and worse. And Sutherland is absolutely stunning in the movements requiring mechanical brilliance in that Decca Alcina. Moreover, Bonynge was rather HIP for his day, but fashions continue to change and today's HIP will be tomorrow's embarrassment. Too bad you're brain washed into believing that recent HIP performances are authentic slices of history.

-david gable

It's his best opera.

-david gable

Thanks for the exceedingly gentle correction of my botching her name!

says...

Right (though I'm not sure what the 'worse' have been...); and given the choice I would take Sutherland and co. too (in fact, that's the choice I did make - didn't keep Christie's). However, it would be odd to characterize Christie's cast as being made up of 'the average voiceless HIP singer/nonentity' - whatever else their flaws may be, they're not that (Renee Fleming, Susan Graham and Natalie Dessay are the principals).

And Sutherland is

Or not.

Too bad

Well, they're an authentic slice of the past 20 years or so....

Yeah, but who is this 'Gutmann' that you can't stand?